Question:

says… Dear asdm, snip Please help me. _Please_.  I beg you. Thank you. Heather in California

I’m so sorry Heather, that you are having to deal with all this. Unfortunately, It seems that we must be completely broken down before our "system" will help. I live in California also and jumped through all the same hoops you have been going through and for many years. I have never had money nor insurance so I have always been on Medi-Cal and I’m now on the county MIA (medically indigent adult) program. I wouldn’t be medicated or treated if not for these programs. Call your county "Behavioral Health" and tell them you need to be evaluated, that it’s an emergency and urgent. Tell them about the suicidal ideation. Do not try to "keep it together" when you get to speak or see a psychiatrist or the person who is doing the evaluation. Be sure they know of your reaction when placed on antidepressants w/o a mood stabiliser. Go to the emegency room if you have to. The hardest part here is getting into "The System." I was dx’d as manic depressive only because a pdoc finally saw me in a mania. (I convinced them to do a 5150 on me, a 72 hour hold usually only done by law enforcement.) Ask family or friends for help with your mother. If she is disabled she is probably eligible for assistance programs, just as you are. Call social services and explain your situation (no money, no job, soon no home) and ask what services they can provide and what county, state or federal programs you may be eligible for, especially emergency ones. You can apply for SSI & SSDI through the Social Security office. State Vocational Rehab will help you figure out what employment would suit you and pay for training but these programs take months to approve you. Find out if there is an advocacy association for helping people find the programs and assistance that they need. One here is called Rolling Start. They will guide you and help you fill out the forms if necessary. See if you have something similar in your area. Call Salvation Army or churches or? and ask for immediate help (food, clothing, shelter.) they may not be able to do much but might have resources. Call your local women’s shelter. I will be thinking of you. Email if you’d like. carol caroly~vonne

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am a new poster here. I need your direction. I don’t have anywhere else to turn. I’m female, in my middle thirties, and I know something is wrong with me, but I’m not sure what. …The last time I went through this was in March. I believed might have PMDD. I saw an OBGYN (nice guy, but in a terrible hurry). He put me on Serafem. I told him then and there that I couldn’t handle SSRIs (been there, done that, ten years ago) but he wrote the script anyway, said — try again. I lasted about four days on Serafem. Not a wink of sleep the whole time, and every symptom I have was exaggerated. I thought I might lose my mind. … … I look back on my life and I realize that something has been wrong with me since childhood. In grade school I was diagnosed (by a school psychologist) with "social phobia." I had panic attacks all though elementary school, coming to a head in intermediate school when I became so afraid of everything and everyone, I refused to go to school at all. … …I went to work for a large bookstore chain. I worked for this bookstore in various capacities until 1999. Of course I garnered a reputation for being something less than a loyal, team player — I was absent a lot due to wildly shifting mood swings (which I attributed to PMS). … I went to a psychiatrist, told her my job was on the line and that I suspected I had ADD. She prescribed Ritalin. I took the Ritalin faithfully, but its affect on me was bizarre: I could concentrate, yes! With the intensity of a laser beam I could concentrate: on a spot on the wall. I would spend hours obsessing over the placement of a comma in a memo. … Morbid thoughts. Suicide ideation. Zero self-esteem, zero self-confidence, zero hopes for the future. This is where you find me today. … I am responsible financially not only for myself, but for my aging mother. She has no income save her social security, and that does not cover much. There’s no pension: she too has a history of depression. … If I do not work, I will end up on the street, quite literally, and so will my now seventy-three year old arthritic and increasingly mentally incompetent mom. You might see why I am in a panic. … If I make an appointment to see yet another county doctor (health care for the indigent), he will listen to me for about five minutes, write a script for god knows what,  and tell me to make an appointment to see him again in two

weeks … (and I strongly suspect the first cause is NOT PMS or PMDD: the symptoms of either malady are not supposed to last all month, every month — nor are they accompanied by what I have come to see as states of abnormal hyper-activity and euphoria, oddly interwoven with black-as-night depression).

Heather, it sounds to me quite likely that you have bipolar disorder, from the things you’ve said.  It also sounds like you are a sensitive, loving, intelligent person with a lot to offer, if you get the right meds and a lower-stress job. I don’t know much about the American system except what I’ve read on this group, so I have to leave it to the others to give you practical advice.  Is there any chance that you could find a really low-stress job that would still bring in enough money for your needs – factory work or something like that? I’m wishing you some good fortune and hoping that your situation improves. Sue (in NZ).

Response:

*cringes*  What is it with our American Health System?  It seriously frightens me sometimes… It seems like you are going through a horrible time…good luck with your visits with the County Hospital.  It doesn’t sound like you’re bipolar, like Sue said…but it sounds like you are going through a hard time.  Keep us posted on your journey and best of luck. *hugs*

Response:

Dear asdm, I am a new poster here. I need your direction.

 Heather, what an ordeal you’ve been going through. It surly does sound like bpd, but only a doc can really say.  I would see about going on disability, & that’s what I’d request at my next appt with a county health care doc. Might want to contact the social security dept to apply – I think there’s a long waiting period.  I also believe you need to be on two different kinds of meds instead of just one. Both a mood stabilizer & an anti-psychotic med.  I feel for ya kiddo, & I hope you get some relief soon.  Hang in there. You do sound like a true fighter.  You’ve been through an awful lot.     Zero1

Response:

Heather: I am sorry you have been having such a difficult time of it. I wish there were some magic wand I could give you to make it all "better" but I fear that isn’t the case. I would see what you can do about getting some assistance with regard to your Mother. I know in the USA that you can get free help if you are a primary care giver to a parent. I know this from experience. I cared for my mother in law and was able to have some respite care so that I could make it to my appointments as well as just get out. I would also suggest you find out about SS Disability while you are searching for answers. I do know this takes time but there may be other supports able to help in the interim…church organizations and even the United way, check your local chapter, the have emergency funds and resources. This is a site that deals with people who have a mental illness and work issues. You may also want to contact he Office of Vocational Rehab. They do wonders with ppl with mental illness and work….even help to find a job that is sympathetic to your needs and illness. If you would like to talk more feel free to email me. Wish I could be of more help. Try to stay focused in the moment and let the next one take care of itself. Hang in there and keep searching till you find the answers….You are worth whatever it takes! When it is dark enough you can see the stars, Saya

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dear asdm, I am a new poster here. I need your direction. I don’t have anywhere else to turn. I’m female, in my middle thirties, and I know something is wrong with me, but I’m not sure what. Not knowing (or not having any clear hunches) makes it that much more difficult to get a diagnosis or treatment. I realize I’ll only have a few minutes to present my case to whatever doctor I wind up seeing, and because last Tuesday I walked off (yet another) job (I was tearful and agitated much of the time — and it showed), I have no income nor insurance: I will have to go to my County Hospital (for the "medical undesirables," as our local paper put it some time ago), and it seems to me, having been there before when uninsured, the doctors there are suspicious, guarded, and weary. They aren’t wild about enigmatic cases; don’t seem to want to do a lot (or any) investigative tests. The last time I went through this was in March. I believed might have PMDD. I saw an OBGYN (nice guy, but in a terrible hurry). He put me on Serafem. I told him then and there that I couldn’t handle SSRIs (been there, done that, ten years ago) but he wrote the script anyway, said — try again. I lasted about four days on Serafem. Not a wink of sleep the whole time, and every symptom I have was exaggerated. I thought I might lose my mind. Less than a week later I was seen  by a nurse practitioner. I explained my reaction to Serafem. She put me on Welbutrin (said, "this will have a calming affect.") A week of Welbutrin and I was truly a basket case. I went again to the County hospital; they suggested I try something else (forget the name). I filled the script but, in terror for my sanity, I never did try it. I don’t know how these doctors expect you to work whilst you’re trying out various psychotropic drugs that may leave you non-functional. I walked away from my last county hospital experience with a firm resolve to eat better, exercise more, start a regimen of St. John’s Wort everyday, three times a day, stay away from alliopaths and just pull myself up by my own pigtails. It hasn’t worked. In March I interviewed for and got a decent job. This one might have worked out (long commute but less stress). In late May, however, the company filed for bankruptcy. I had to scramble for other work, and I took the first thing offered me: transcription. From late May until just this last Tuesday, I have spent every weekday, up to 13 hours a day, in a small, windowless, fluorescent-lit room typing my brains out, trying to meet deadlines under tremendous pressure. I broke under that pressure on Tuesday. I walked out. I have heard hence that a number of people in the office had thought all along that I was a bit of a nut. I’d been caught crying a couple of times in my office, or locked in a bathroom stall. Shortly before I walked out, my boss remarked that I seemed to bring a lot of "drama" to the job. The fact was, I was going through the tortures of hell the whole time I was there (but I did my job, and I did it well). I tried (with much anxiety) to cover up my misery, to appear "normal." I thought I was hiding the fact that I was going slowly insane in that little windowless room pretty darn well. I felt a constant anxiety not to show how horrible I was feeling. As many of you likely know very well, most people do not understand "feeling horrible" —  feeling out of control emotionally — *unless* there is some obvious external reason for it. Hyper-vigilant efforts to hide my upset emotions of course made me even more stressed out and tearful — and it turned out to be all for naught: my managers had perceived me as being "off" in some way all along (and they were right — I’m off, I’m way, way, off). My symptoms indicate either serious PMS or manic depression mimicking PMS. In either event, my system rejects SSRIs. There are other (countless other) drugs I might try, but I have to go back to work. But again, how can I work while taking psych drugs which may leave me looped — good for nothing? One cannot hide trembling hands, chattering teeth, clenched jaws, inattentiveness due to lack of sleep, and copious tears bordering on hysteria. One can’t tell an employer, "Listen, I have some kind of mental problem and I’m trying out a lot of different psychiatric drugs that may do strange things to my brain chemistry, resulting in strange behavior and poor performance. In addition, I might be absent a little or a lot, depending on the drug’s affect on me. I’m sure you will understand." Uh huh. Sure. I look back on my life and I realize that something has been wrong with me since childhood. In grade school I was diagnosed (by a school psychologist) with "social phobia." I had panic attacks all though elementary school, coming to a head in intermediate school when I became so afraid of everything and everyone, I refused to go to school at all. The school shrink told my mom to "drag me to school kicking and screaming, vomiting and gaging … whatever it takes." They would handle it from there. I became truant. I got on the school administration’s bad side. No one tried to help me or ask me what might be the problem (although I doubt I would have been able to articulate it, if they had). I was labeled "trouble," and more often than not I was on detention, isolated from my classmates, or even put on extended periods of suspension (which was often a relief, but my grades suffered for it). I was lectured at and yelled at and accused of taking street drugs (I’ve never touched an illicit drug in my life). In high school the problems escalated. Truancy got me bounced out of regular high school (I wasn’t really "truant" in the fun, let’s-drive-to-the-beach-and-party sense; I wasn’t even off campus: I was hiding, in the girls’ lavatory, perched on the toilet seat so no one looking for me would spy my dangling feet). I landed in a "continuation" high school, where they send the real "druggies" and troublemakers. There were no regularly scheduled classes — just a lot of kids sitting in a "quad" smoking cigarettes (and other things) listening to heavy metal music on their boom boxes — planning the next "party." I was an outcast among outcasts. There was a small library, and in a year and a half I had read every book in its holdings. At seventeen I took the GED (a high school proficiency examination), passed it and left for junior college. I loved my classes, but the constant  tearfulness & social phobia (and the ever-present anxiety to cover it up) caused me to "withdraw" from nearly every course (and I was never able to "get it together" enough to repeat them; hence, no degree). My GPA averaged a D minus, and eventually the college deans asked me to leave. I went to work for a large bookstore chain. I worked for this bookstore in various capacities until 1999. Of course I garnered a reputation for being something less than a loyal, team player — I was absent a lot due to wildly shifting mood swings (which I attributed to PMS). A few of my managers tried to give me a chance; show some sign of belief in me — and eventually I rose to the rank of department supervisor. But I always ended up disappointing and alienating these managers — I could never measure up to (or maintain for any length of time) their expectations of me, and they inevitably took my failure as a willful, "screw you" attitude, never seeing that I was doing the very best I could — nearly killing myself trying. I began to dread going to work. I’d become stigmatized. A lot of my friends stopped talking to me, or held me at arm’s length. On the face of it I was a pleasant, intelligent, well-spoken young woman. But scratch the surface and, in the belief of many of the managers, you’ll find a flake and a fall-apart — a hypochondriac/chronic absentee who *consistently* lets everybody down. I was a lemon; a "bad" employee. As it was with my school experience, I was earnest and eager to please — but I had a file on me as thick as a phonebook, choc-a-bloc with negative reports. My beloved department (fiction and literature), which I tended with care and a great deal of pride (when I was able — and often, even when I was not) — was taken away from me. I was demoted to bookseller (cashier).

… read more »

Response:

Dear asdm, I am a new poster here. I need your direction. I don

Question:

Dear asd, I am a new poster here. I need your direction. I don

Question:

Icky stuff in here.  Hey really though Eddie, hydropnonic veggies, organic as can be might just sell to them there southern folks????  Parrot poop fertilizer, yes I have a market now….. Bob W QOF — We have a couple of web sites, check them out have fun, http://www.onemorebird.com/ http://home.pacifier.com/~rivercst/index.html – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Humans?  Diane is a botanist right?  You must get a big green house and raise orchids, all the Canooks in California raise Orchids. Sweetie! Diane is a botanist and she likes plants that eat flesh, so maybe raising Venus Flytraps and other such things is a possibility for making bucks that will keep her warm and fed when my trembling hands fail to keep up my part of the bargain.  As for the Orchid thing… she is very good with flowers and such.  I prefer growing things we can eat.  Maybe I will join her though in raising specialized orchids. I’ve got an idea for one that grows in the roughest conditions and gives nourishment to those that care for it.  I may call it Wheelerati-Vivitatus.  Some may call me sycophantus for naming it such.  Fuck em. Eddie

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Humans?  Diane is a botanist right?  You must get a big green house and raise orchids, all the Canooks in California raise Orchids.

Sweetie! Diane is a botanist and she likes plants that eat flesh, so maybe raising Venus Flytraps and other such things is a possibility for making bucks that will keep her warm and fed when my trembling hands fail to keep up my part of the bargain.  As for the Orchid thing… she is very good with flowers and such.  I prefer growing things we can eat.  Maybe I will join her though in raising specialized orchids. I’ve got an idea for one that grows in the roughest conditions and gives nourishment to those that care for it.  I may call it Wheelerati-Vivitatus.  Some may call me sycophantus for naming it such.  Fuck em. Eddie

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Humans?  Diane is a botanist right?  You must get a big green house and raise orchids, all the Canooks in California raise Orchids.  Sweetie! Bob W QOF — We have a couple of web sites, check them out have fun, http://www.onemorebird.com/ http://home.pacifier.com/~rivercst/index.html – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Now I am wondering what I can breed in Cal-If-Or-Nigh-Eh that will allow FWW and I to retire in comfort and ease.  Any ideas ? Eddie

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Daddy fertilizes the egg, Mommy lays the egg, Mommy sits on the eggs until they hatch, Daddy feeds Mommy, Mommy feeds the babies for two or three weeks, mean old Bob "pulls" the babies out of the nest to bring into the house to handfeed so that they will be sweet and like humans.  Mommy and Daddy get to sleep at night, mean old Bob gets to feed babies every four hours for a week or so until they get bigger then three to four times a day during the day.  Baby birds grow-up sweet and liking humans and go live with Monika after she gives mean old Bob lots of her hard earned money. But we don’t smoke at any time during the process!

Kinda funny you should mention this.  FWW (Future Wonder-Wife) and I got back from my favouritetest cousin (also best man in future nuptuals) yesterday, and Mrs. FC(BM) has a wondrous array of salamanders, gekkos, chameleons, and other assorted reptilian lifeforms in house.  We believe that she is breeding them for future sales instead of Siberian Huskies that she used to do.  You have birds.  She has lizards.  Now I am wondering what I can breed in Cal-If-Or-Nigh-Eh that will allow FWW and I to retire in comfort and ease.  Any ideas ? Eddie

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Thanks for the explanation. No thanks for the bird offer. Have enough in my yard that I have to take care off. Monika

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Daddy fertilizes the egg, Mommy lays the egg, Mommy sits on the eggs until they hatch, Daddy feeds Mommy, Mommy feeds the babies for two or three weeks, mean old Bob "pulls" the babies out of the nest to bring into the house to handfeed so that they will be sweet and like humans.  Mommy and Daddy get to sleep at night, mean old Bob gets to feed babies every four hours for a week or so until they get bigger then three to four times a day during the day.  Baby birds grow-up sweet and liking humans and go live with Monika after she gives mean old Bob lots of her hard earned money.  But we don’t smoke at any time during the process! Bob W QOF — We have a couple of web sites, check them out have fun, http://www.onemorebird.com/ http://home.pacifier.com/~rivercst/index.html Bob what do you mean when you say " I will be pulling four Lutino Ringnecks babies". I don’t understand when you say you are "pulling’" the birds. Monika QOF they add up, the meters grow, all we need to do is not feed it habit. Bizzy around here, the farm is active as heck.  Finishing up a trio of Blue Crown Conures (paulie type birds), still feeding "Elmo" an African Senegal. This weekend I will be pulling four Lutino Ringnecks babies and watching three Blue Front Amazon babies who are not quite ready to pull. Handfeeding baby birds is good therapy, watching them develop from little featherless balls of life into mature energetic beasties in 6-8 weeks or so reminds me of how it works, major development if the work is done. If you doubt it just watch, WE JUST DO IT, every day folks, every day . Bob W QOF plus a little more each day — We have a couple of web sites, check them out have fun, http://www.onemorebird.com/ http://home.pacifier.com/~rivercst/index.html

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Bob what do you mean when you say " I will be pulling four Lutino Ringnecks babies". I don’t understand when you say you are "pulling’" the birds. Monika QOF

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – they add up, the meters grow, all we need to do is not feed it habit. Bizzy around here, the farm is active as heck.  Finishing up a trio of Blue Crown Conures (paulie type birds), still feeding "Elmo" an African Senegal. This weekend I will be pulling four Lutino Ringnecks babies and watching three Blue Front Amazon babies who are not quite ready to pull. Handfeeding baby birds is good therapy, watching them develop from little featherless balls of life into mature energetic beasties in 6-8 weeks or so reminds me of how it works, major development if the work is done. If you doubt it just watch, WE JUST DO IT, every day folks, every day . Bob W QOF plus a little more each day — We have a couple of web sites, check them out have fun, http://www.onemorebird.com/ http://home.pacifier.com/~rivercst/index.html

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Daddy fertilizes the egg, Mommy lays the egg, Mommy sits on the eggs until they hatch, Daddy feeds Mommy, Mommy feeds the babies for two or three weeks, mean old Bob "pulls" the babies out of the nest to bring into the house to handfeed so that they will be sweet and like humans.  Mommy and Daddy get to sleep at night, mean old Bob gets to feed babies every four hours for a week or so until they get bigger then three to four times a day during the day.  Baby birds grow-up sweet and liking humans and go live with Monika after she gives mean old Bob lots of her hard earned money.  But we don’t smoke at any time during the process! Bob W QOF — We have a couple of web sites, check them out have fun, http://www.onemorebird.com/ http://home.pacifier.com/~rivercst/index.html

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bob what do you mean when you say " I will be pulling four Lutino Ringnecks babies". I don’t understand when you say you are "pulling’" the birds. Monika QOF they add up, the meters grow, all we need to do is not feed it habit. Bizzy around here, the farm is active as heck.  Finishing up a trio of Blue Crown Conures (paulie type birds), still feeding "Elmo" an African Senegal. This weekend I will be pulling four Lutino Ringnecks babies and watching three Blue Front Amazon babies who are not quite ready to pull. Handfeeding baby birds is good therapy, watching them develop from little featherless balls of life into mature energetic beasties in 6-8 weeks or so reminds me of how it works, major development if the work is done. If you doubt it just watch, WE JUST DO IT, every day folks, every day . Bob W QOF plus a little more each day — We have a couple of web sites, check them out have fun, http://www.onemorebird.com/ http://home.pacifier.com/~rivercst/index.html

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Even if I don’t answer them all I love your daily postings Bob in fact I look forward to them hugs padders plodding on (

Question:

thank you.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  One day a young man was standing in the middle of the town  proclaiming that he had the most beautiful heart in the  whole valley. A large crowd gathered and they all admired his  heart for it was perfect. There was not a mark or a flaw in it.  Yes, they all agreed it truly was the most beautiful heart  they had ever seen. The young man was very proud and boasted more  loudly about his beautiful heart. Suddenly, an old man appeared  at the front of the crowd and said, "Why your heart is not nearly  as beautiful as mine." The crowd and the young man looked at the  old man’s heart. It was beating strongly, but full of scars, it  had places where pieces had been removed and other pieces put in,  but they didn’t fit quite right and there were several jagged edges.  In fact, in some places there were deep gouges where  whole pieces were missing. The people stared – how  can he say his heart is more beautiful, they thought?  The young man looked at the old man’s heart and saw its  state and laughed. "You must be joking," he said.  "Compare your heart with mine, mine is perfect and yours is a  mess of scars and tears." "Yes," said the old man, "Yours is perfect  looking but I would never trade with you. You see, every scar  represents a person to whom I have given my love – I tear out a  piece of my heart and give it to them, and often they give me a piece  of their heart which fits into the empty place in my heart, but  because the pieces aren’t exact, I have some rough edges, which I  cherish, because they remind me of the love we shared. Sometimes I  have given pieces of my heart away, and the other person hasn’t  returned a piece of his heart to me. These are the empty gouges –  giving love is taking a chance. Although these gouges are painful,  they stay open, reminding me of the love I have for these people too,  and I hope someday they may return and fill the space I have waiting.  So now do you see what true beauty is?"  The young man stood silently with tears running down his  cheeks. He walked up to the old man, reached into his  perfect young and beautiful heart, and ripped a piece out.  He offered it to the old man with trembling hands. The old man took  his offering, placed it in his heart and then took a piece from his  old scarred heart and placed it in the wound in the young man’s  heart. It fit, but not perfectly, as there were some jagged edges.  The young man looked at his heart, not perfect anymore but more  beautiful than ever, since love from the old man’s heart flowed into  his. They embraced and walked away side by side.  How sad it must be to go through life with a whole heart.  Remember…  Work like you don’t need the money.  Love like you’ve never been hurt.  Dance like nobody is watching.

Response:

 One day a young man was standing in the middle of the town  proclaiming that he had the most beautiful heart in the  whole valley. A large crowd gathered and they all admired his  heart for it was perfect. There was not a mark or a flaw in it.  Yes, they all agreed it truly was the most beautiful heart  they had ever seen. The young man was very proud and boasted more  loudly about his beautiful heart. Suddenly, an old man appeared  at the front of the crowd and said, "Why your heart is not nearly  as beautiful as mine." The crowd and the young man looked at the  old man’s heart. It was beating strongly, but full of scars, it  had places where pieces had been removed and other pieces put in,  but they didn’t fit quite right and there were several jagged edges.  In fact, in some places there were deep gouges where  whole pieces were missing. The people stared – how  can he say his heart is more beautiful, they thought?  The young man looked at the old man’s heart and saw its  state and laughed. "You must be joking," he said.  "Compare your heart with mine, mine is perfect and yours is a  mess of scars and tears." "Yes," said the old man, "Yours is perfect  looking but I would never trade with you. You see, every scar  represents a person to whom I have given my love – I tear out a  piece of my heart and give it to them, and often they give me a piece  of their heart which fits into the empty place in my heart, but  because the pieces aren’t exact, I have some rough edges, which I    cherish, because they remind me of the love we shared. Sometimes I  have given pieces of my heart away, and the other person hasn’t  returned a piece of his heart to me. These are the empty gouges –  giving love is taking a chance. Although these gouges are painful,  they stay open, reminding me of the love I have for these people too,  and I hope someday they may return and fill the space I have waiting.  So now do you see what true beauty is?"  The young man stood silently with tears running down his  cheeks. He walked up to the old man, reached into his  perfect young and beautiful heart, and ripped a piece out.  He offered it to the old man with trembling hands. The old man took  his offering, placed it in his heart and then took a piece from his  old scarred heart and placed it in the wound in the young man’s  heart. It fit, but not perfectly, as there were some jagged edges.  The young man looked at his heart, not perfect anymore but more  beautiful than ever, since love from the old man’s heart flowed into  his. They embraced and walked away side by side.  How sad it must be to go through life with a whole heart.  Remember…  Work like you don’t need the money.  Love like you’ve never been hurt.  Dance like nobody is watching.

Response:

Question:

Today I was drinking a bottle of OJ, holding it in my left hand, when I was through my left hand started to shake really bad especially when I made a fist. What does that mean? Could Paxil and flax oil cause that?

Response:

Today I was drinking a bottle of OJ, holding it in my left hand, when I was through my left hand started to shake really bad especially when I made a fist. What does that mean?

In and of itself?  Who knows.  Do keep an eye on this tho.  Some questions to keep in the back of your head: 1) does the shaking happen only when you are engaged in volitional activity (doing something with that hand) or does it also happen when the hand is at rest? 2) any other body movements–does your head turn to the left when this happens? 3) any alteration in consciousness?  (feeling spacy?) if the symptoms continue, consult your neurologist. Could Paxil and flax oil cause that?

Who knows?  Paxil unlikely (given the pharmacology of the drug).  Since no one really knows what’s in flax oil, well who knows what could be causing what. mark — The rainbow is more beautiful than the pot at the end of it, because the rainbow is now.  And the pot never turns out to be quite what I expected.                                         Hugh Prather http://www.goti.net/members/mmorin/index.htm for e-mail replies, remove the obvious

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Question:

No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up.

Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^) -Sass 7M+

Response:

Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^)

Don’t go home with your hard-on. Steve — http://www.angelfire.com/nj2/sjgrant ICQ #37620434 One month, one week, 17 hours, 45 minutes and 30 seconds. 1162 cigarettes not smoked, saving $246.96. Life saved: 4 days, 50 minutes.

Response:

aaaaarrrrggggghhhhhhhhhh iwisse  <g Two weeks, 13 hours, 8 minutes and 4 seconds. 290 cigarettes not smoked, saving $40.73. Life saved: 1 day, 10 minutes.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

FWIW, Someone had mentioned the Beach Boys, got me to thinking about June Dune Buggies   (I know the word bug is in there, but dune buggies are fun!) Or, how about Benny and Joons? Jeanne

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

(Has disturbingly vivid mental image of a severely dour Bob shuffling about his flat, setting out party favors whilst tapping his toes and humming along to "Dress Rehearsal Rag"…..)

Ah yes indeed, such a reference drove me to play it again. Let’s just sample a line or two.. "Now if you can manage to get your trembling hands to behave, Why don’t you try unwrapping a stainless steel razor blade. That’s right, it’s come to this, yes it’s come to this." Lovely song, really excellent.  What a life that bloke’s had,,,,,,amazing,,,, wow !! Just in case anybody is in need of a life this afternnoon then may I introduce you to my very own, ‘The Vicars Prayer Drum’. I think you’ll agree It has some rather nice Cohenesque moments. The Vicar’s Prayer Drum To say that love is mayhem death is bliss is a secret soul on the edge I kiss. To say this edge in a truth by a vow was no common thrust would be lying now. Believe you me it is a closeness chest where I wear this private vemonous vest. There are thoughts of brain in a closing vice as a freedom find from slug maggot life. Look at my genital sexless wallet here under my belt as a dead lead bullet. The curse my body to a tissue feel was muscle spine seize of lack love squeal. This inner most scab in social sermon ooze like puss from a poison dungeon. Give me a coffin and a death God come and let me lie for the vicars’prayer drum. bobf 3m – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Non – Cohen enthusiasts just won’t get this reference at all…it’s O.K. Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 0:10 I haven’t smoked 11,300 cigs I’ve saved $1,836.25 Hoping to change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

I once took part in a karaoke version of Closing Time… .. it cheered me up no end. Sandra – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up. Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^) -Sass 7M+

Response:

"Bob Flemming" wrote Just in case anybody is in need of a life this afternnoon then may I introduce you to my very own, ‘The Vicars Prayer Drum’. I think you’ll agree It has some rather nice Cohenesque moments.

<snip,snip,snip….. BOB! You’re scaring me! Get the hell out of the house, NOW! Fresh air; sunshine; see other live human beings, my lad! That’s the ticket! Walk up and down the road, flap your arms, get the blood moving! HUP, TWO, THREE, FOUR….Bend and stretch…. Feeling a little better now? Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 2:58 I haven’t smoked 11,309 cigs I’ve saved $1,837.71 Trying to change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Peer pressure’s a bitch. Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

The names being suggested are just a little bit to nice. Quitting is a tough battle and IMHO, we should have a mean, nasty name. One with attitude. How about something like, The Nicodemon Slaying Bloody Bastards From Hell. With a name like that, no one would mess with us. Rob 1m2d

Response:

"Steve Grant" wrote

  Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^) Don’t go home with your hard-on.

I might have known you guys’d be Cohen fans, too. Why is it that if I dig just a little bit, I find these amazing similarities in cultural tastes — music, literature, humor — that people I’ve come to admire and respect share with me? It’s not like we presented each other with lists, up front, or anything… It happens time and time again. I’m still reeling from Suze catching both an Anais Nin and a Wim Wenders reference in one of my posts. This place and its denizens never fails to amaze me…. Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 3:05 I haven’t smoked 11,309 cigs I’ve saved $1,837.71 My new mission:  To change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

The names being suggested are just a little bit to nice. Quitting is a tough battle and IMHO, we should have a mean, nasty name. One with attitude. How about something like, The Nicodemon Slaying Bloody Bastards From Hell. With a name like that, no one would mess with us.

LOL!!  Sounds good.  Nobody in their right mind would want to mess with me right now anyway…. Sally – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Rob 1m2d

Response:

Jef, Relax my old china, everything’s cool, just clocked up a quick 30 miles today on the old pedal machine, blood pumping fine, lungs bellowing and I’ll be out for a few beers this evening to satisfy my screaming nerves, and then back for chat. No worries. BobF 3m – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -"Bob Flemming" wrote Just in case anybody is in need of a life this afternnoon then may I introduce you to my very own, ‘The Vicars Prayer Drum’. I think you’ll agree It has some rather nice Cohenesque moments. <snip,snip,snip….. BOB! You’re scaring me! Get the hell out of the house, NOW! Fresh air; sunshine; see other live human beings, my lad! That’s the ticket! Walk up and down the road, flap your arms, get the blood moving! HUP, TWO, THREE, FOUR….Bend and stretch…. Feeling a little better now? Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 2:58 I haven’t smoked 11,309 cigs I’ve saved $1,837.71 Trying to change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Peer pressure’s a bitch. Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

LMAO . . . somehow I never expected the concepts of karaoke and Leonard Cohen to mix together . . . whoa boy!  Although I wouldn’t mind being woo-ed with a decent rendition of I’m Your Man . . . sigh. -Sass

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I once took part in a karaoke version of Closing Time… .. it cheered me up no end. Sandra No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up. Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^) -Sass 7M+

Response:

Just call it the English language speaking peoples PIMP assoication and be done with it. I would suggest the National PIMP association as my T-shirt says and depicts but we have too many English speaking countries here to do that. Ted * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up.

That is spooky Bob. I was on the buddies page checking out the fine people of AS3 yesterday with the Eagle Man. When we got to you I said….."I bet he likes Morrissey and Leonard Cohen" He he he he he!!!!! That’s weird eh? Beth QOF+ Who also likes a bit of Leonard when I am feeling on the brink.

Response:

OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

Or how about Free And Happy-Quitters, or FAH-Q – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

"Bob Flemming" wrote No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up…..

(Has disturbingly vivid mental image of a severely dour Bob shuffling about his flat, setting out party favors whilst tapping his toes and humming along to "Dress Rehearsal Rag"…..) Non – Cohen enthusiasts just won’t get this reference at all…it’s O.K. Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 0:10 I haven’t smoked 11,300 cigs I’ve saved $1,836.25 Hoping to change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

bob, you’ll do no such thing.  It is now July so if you bust your quit for us – you couldn’t join us anyway <g Anyway, your MMM suits you! Peter – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To be perfectly honest, I’ve good mind to go and down a barrel of Guinness tonight, smoke myself stupid, wake up tomorrow morning and say. ‘hey great, now I can be part of the lunacy June fringe!’. Shit, I’m feeling left out here. bobf 3m I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

To be perfectly honest, I’ve good mind to go and down a barrel of Guinness tonight, smoke myself stupid, wake up tomorrow morning and say. ‘hey great, now I can be part of the lunacy June fringe!’. Shit, I’m feeling left out here. bobf 3m – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

Can’t be done, Bob- It’s July But, hey – you and I are still quit the same week, no? Hugs, Elle QOF – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To be perfectly honest, I’ve good mind to go and down a barrel of Guinness tonight, smoke myself stupid, wake up tomorrow morning and say. ‘hey great, now I can be part of the lunacy June fringe!’. Shit, I’m feeling left out here. bobf 3m I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Can’t be done, Bob- It’s July

ah well, too bad then, the thought did not hang around for too long, anyway. Taysum’s organization is not for the faint-hearted anyway – you need special mental toughness to endure that crazy household I can tell you. Midnight parties, screaming in the middle of the night, dustbin lids crashing around outside and wild manic shreaks of ,,,, No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up. But, hey – you and I are still quit the same week, no?

Could be, could be…Nicole, where are you with your stats m’dear? BobF 3m XXXXXXXXX – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hugs, Elle QOF To be perfectly honest, I’ve good mind to go and down a barrel of Guinness tonight, smoke myself stupid, wake up tomorrow morning and say. ‘hey great, now I can be part of the lunacy June fringe!’. Shit, I’m feeling left out here. bobf 3m I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it!

<snip Peter

ROFLMAO!! Damn, Peter…. coffee really burns when it comes out my nose Brad — I haven’t smoked in 6d 23:05.  That’s 243 cigs not smoked, $38.88 saved toward the Roadstar Motorcycle Fund , and 20:15 of my life saved… which gives me that much more time to ride!

Response:

ROFLMAOPIMP Maybe we should just be the PIMP’s Ann

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it!

<snip Peter

ROFLMAO!! Damn, Peter…. coffee really burns when it comes out my nose Brad — I haven’t smoked in 6d 23:05.  That’s 243 cigs not smoked, $38.88 saved toward the Roadstar Motorcycle Fund , and 20:15 of my life saved… which gives me that much more time to ride!

Response:

ROFLMAOPIMP Maybe we should just be the PIMP’s Ann

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

To be perfectly honest, I’ve good mind to go and down a barrel of Guinness tonight, smoke myself stupid, wake up tomorrow morning and say. ‘hey great, now I can be part of the lunacy June fringe!’. Shit, I’m feeling left out here. bobf 3m – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

Can’t be done, Bob- It’s July But, hey – you and I are still quit the same week, no? Hugs, Elle QOF – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To be perfectly honest, I’ve good mind to go and down a barrel of Guinness tonight, smoke myself stupid, wake up tomorrow morning and say. ‘hey great, now I can be part of the lunacy June fringe!’. Shit, I’m feeling left out here. bobf 3m I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Can’t be done, Bob- It’s July

ah well, too bad then, the thought did not hang around for too long, anyway. Taysum’s organization is not for the faint-hearted anyway – you need special mental toughness to endure that crazy household I can tell you. Midnight parties, screaming in the middle of the night, dustbin lids crashing around outside and wild manic shreaks of ,,,, No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up. But, hey – you and I are still quit the same week, no?

Could be, could be…Nicole, where are you with your stats m’dear? BobF 3m XXXXXXXXX – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hugs, Elle QOF To be perfectly honest, I’ve good mind to go and down a barrel of Guinness tonight, smoke myself stupid, wake up tomorrow morning and say. ‘hey great, now I can be part of the lunacy June fringe!’. Shit, I’m feeling left out here. bobf 3m I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

"Bob Flemming" wrote No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up…..

(Has disturbingly vivid mental image of a severely dour Bob shuffling about his flat, setting out party favors whilst tapping his toes and humming along to "Dress Rehearsal Rag"…..) Non – Cohen enthusiasts just won’t get this reference at all…it’s O.K. Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 0:10 I haven’t smoked 11,300 cigs I’ve saved $1,836.25 Hoping to change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

bob, you’ll do no such thing.  It is now July so if you bust your quit for us – you couldn’t join us anyway <g Anyway, your MMM suits you! Peter – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To be perfectly honest, I’ve good mind to go and down a barrel of Guinness tonight, smoke myself stupid, wake up tomorrow morning and say. ‘hey great, now I can be part of the lunacy June fringe!’. Shit, I’m feeling left out here. bobf 3m I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

Or how about Free And Happy-Quitters, or FAH-Q – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up.

Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^) -Sass 7M+

Response:

Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^)

Don’t go home with your hard-on. Steve — http://www.angelfire.com/nj2/sjgrant ICQ #37620434 One month, one week, 17 hours, 45 minutes and 30 seconds. 1162 cigarettes not smoked, saving $246.96. Life saved: 4 days, 50 minutes.

Response:

aaaaarrrrggggghhhhhhhhhh iwisse  <g Two weeks, 13 hours, 8 minutes and 4 seconds. 290 cigarettes not smoked, saving $40.73. Life saved: 1 day, 10 minutes.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

FWIW, Someone had mentioned the Beach Boys, got me to thinking about June Dune Buggies   (I know the word bug is in there, but dune buggies are fun!) Or, how about Benny and Joons? Jeanne

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – OK the below is a funny – so if you don’t want to be offended – then don’t read it! I was thinking of names for the group fomerly known as the Juner Buggies, who were formely known as the June Buggers, and were formely just me and Ann!  God we’ve changed our name more times thatn the "artist" (or is it still swiggle?) I thought we could maybe be the "Anti Smoking Society" or ‘ASS’ for short. Or "Breathing Air’s Lovely Less Smoke" or ‘BALLS’ for short. Or, Forever U Can Kick it" or ‘FUCK it’ for short. Or, "Can U Not Tell – I Don’t Smoke" or ‘CUNT I don’t smoke’ for short. so what do people prefer: ASS BALLS CUNT I don’t smoke FUCK it Peter

Response:

(Has disturbingly vivid mental image of a severely dour Bob shuffling about his flat, setting out party favors whilst tapping his toes and humming along to "Dress Rehearsal Rag"…..)

Ah yes indeed, such a reference drove me to play it again. Let’s just sample a line or two.. "Now if you can manage to get your trembling hands to behave, Why don’t you try unwrapping a stainless steel razor blade. That’s right, it’s come to this, yes it’s come to this." Lovely song, really excellent.  What a life that bloke’s had,,,,,,amazing,,,, wow !! Just in case anybody is in need of a life this afternnoon then may I introduce you to my very own, ‘The Vicars Prayer Drum’. I think you’ll agree It has some rather nice Cohenesque moments. The Vicar’s Prayer Drum To say that love is mayhem death is bliss is a secret soul on the edge I kiss. To say this edge in a truth by a vow was no common thrust would be lying now. Believe you me it is a closeness chest where I wear this private vemonous vest. There are thoughts of brain in a closing vice as a freedom find from slug maggot life. Look at my genital sexless wallet here under my belt as a dead lead bullet. The curse my body to a tissue feel was muscle spine seize of lack love squeal. This inner most scab in social sermon ooze like puss from a poison dungeon. Give me a coffin and a death God come and let me lie for the vicars’prayer drum. bobf 3m – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Non – Cohen enthusiasts just won’t get this reference at all…it’s O.K. Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 0:10 I haven’t smoked 11,300 cigs I’ve saved $1,836.25 Hoping to change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

I once took part in a karaoke version of Closing Time… .. it cheered me up no end. Sandra – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up. Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^) -Sass 7M+

Response:

"Bob Flemming" wrote Just in case anybody is in need of a life this afternnoon then may I introduce you to my very own, ‘The Vicars Prayer Drum’. I think you’ll agree It has some rather nice Cohenesque moments.

<snip,snip,snip….. BOB! You’re scaring me! Get the hell out of the house, NOW! Fresh air; sunshine; see other live human beings, my lad! That’s the ticket! Walk up and down the road, flap your arms, get the blood moving! HUP, TWO, THREE, FOUR….Bend and stretch…. Feeling a little better now? Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 2:58 I haven’t smoked 11,309 cigs I’ve saved $1,837.71 Trying to change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Peer pressure’s a bitch. Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

The names being suggested are just a little bit to nice. Quitting is a tough battle and IMHO, we should have a mean, nasty name. One with attitude. How about something like, The Nicodemon Slaying Bloody Bastards From Hell. With a name like that, no one would mess with us. Rob 1m2d

Response:

"Steve Grant" wrote

  Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^) Don’t go home with your hard-on.

I might have known you guys’d be Cohen fans, too. Why is it that if I dig just a little bit, I find these amazing similarities in cultural tastes — music, literature, humor — that people I’ve come to admire and respect share with me? It’s not like we presented each other with lists, up front, or anything… It happens time and time again. I’m still reeling from Suze catching both an Anais Nin and a Wim Wenders reference in one of my posts. This place and its denizens never fails to amaze me…. Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 3:05 I haven’t smoked 11,309 cigs I’ve saved $1,837.71 My new mission:  To change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

The names being suggested are just a little bit to nice. Quitting is a tough battle and IMHO, we should have a mean, nasty name. One with attitude. How about something like, The Nicodemon Slaying Bloody Bastards From Hell. With a name like that, no one would mess with us.

LOL!!  Sounds good.  Nobody in their right mind would want to mess with me right now anyway…. Sally – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Rob 1m2d

Response:

Jef, Relax my old china, everything’s cool, just clocked up a quick 30 miles today on the old pedal machine, blood pumping fine, lungs bellowing and I’ll be out for a few beers this evening to satisfy my screaming nerves, and then back for chat. No worries. BobF 3m – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -"Bob Flemming" wrote Just in case anybody is in need of a life this afternnoon then may I introduce you to my very own, ‘The Vicars Prayer Drum’. I think you’ll agree It has some rather nice Cohenesque moments. <snip,snip,snip….. BOB! You’re scaring me! Get the hell out of the house, NOW! Fresh air; sunshine; see other live human beings, my lad! That’s the ticket! Walk up and down the road, flap your arms, get the blood moving! HUP, TWO, THREE, FOUR….Bend and stretch…. Feeling a little better now? Jef. Clean for 7m 1w 6d 2:58 I haven’t smoked 11,309 cigs I’ve saved $1,837.71 Trying to change my sig line as often as Marilyn… Peer pressure’s a bitch. Come visit us at http://www.xuyunmusic.com/as3/quitbuddies/BuddiesIndex.html

Response:

LMAO . . . somehow I never expected the concepts of karaoke and Leonard Cohen to mix together . . . whoa boy!  Although I wouldn’t mind being woo-ed with a decent rendition of I’m Your Man . . . sigh. -Sass

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I once took part in a karaoke version of Closing Time… .. it cheered me up no end. Sandra No I don’t think it’s for me anyway. Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up. Oh yeah, some uplifting tune like Famous Blue Raincoat. ;^) -Sass 7M+

Response:

Just call it the English language speaking peoples PIMP assoication and be done with it. I would suggest the National PIMP association as my T-shirt says and depicts but we have too many English speaking countries here to do that. Ted * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response:

Prefer a bit of Leonard Cohen when I need cheering up.

That is spooky Bob. I was on the buddies page checking out the fine people of AS3 yesterday with the Eagle Man. When we got to you I said….."I bet he likes Morrissey and Leonard Cohen" He he he he he!!!!! That’s weird eh? Beth QOF+ Who also likes a bit of Leonard when I am feeling on the brink.

Response:

Question:

THIS WAS VERY BEAUTIFUL.  I NEEDED A GOOD CRY! Monica "TackneyNY" <tackne…@aol.com

wrote in message

news:20000613145932.21209.00002168@ng-ft1.aol.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I got this in the mail today from a friend of mine THE MOST BEAUTIFUL HEART  (Author Unknown)  One day a young man was standing in the middle of the town proclaiming

that

he  had the most beautiful heart in the whole valley. A large crowd gathered

and

 they all admired his heart for it was perfect. There was not a mark or a

flaw

 in it. Yes, they all agreed it truly was the most beautiful heart they

had

ever  seen. The young man was very proud and boasted more loudly about his beautiful  heart.  Suddenly, an old man appeared at the front of the crowd and said "Why

your

 heart is not nearly as beautiful as mine." The crowd and the young man

looked

 at the old man’s heart. It was beating strongly, but full of scars, it

had

 places where pieces had been removed and other pieces put in, but they

didn’t

 fit quite right and there were several jagged edges. In fact, in some

places

 there were deep gouges where whole pieces were missing.  The people stared – how can he say his heart is more beautiful, they

thought?

 The young man looked at the old man’s heart and saw its state and

laughed.

"You  must be joking," he said. "Compare your heart with mine, mine is perfect

and

 yours is a mess of scars and tears."  "Yes," said the old man, "Yours is perfect looking but I would never

trade

with  you. You see, every scar represents a person to whom I have given my

love. I

 tear out a piece of my heart and give it to them, and often they give me

a

 piece of their heart which fits into the empty place in my heart, but

because

 the pieces aren’t exact, I have some rough edges, which I cherish,

because

they  remind me of the love we shared.  Sometimes I have given pieces of my heart away, and the other person

hasn’t

 returned a piece of his heart to me. These are the empty gouges – giving

love

 is taking a chance. Although these gouges are painful, they stay open,  reminding me of the love I have for these people too, and I hope someday

they

 may return and fill the space I have waiting. So now do you see what true  beauty is?"  The young man stood silently with tears running down his cheeks. He

walked up

 to the old man, reached into his perfect young and beautiful heart, and ripped  a piece out. He offered it to the old man with trembling hands. The old

man

 took his offering, placed it in his heart and then took a piece from his

old

 scarred heart and placed it in the wound in the young man’s heart. It

fit,

but  not perfectly, as there were some jagged edges.  The young man looked at his heart, not perfect anymore but more beautiful than  ever, since love from the old man’s heart flowed into his. They embraced

and

 walked away side by side. Operation Just Cause POW/MIA Bring Them Home http://hometown.aol.com/tackneyny/brooklyntovietnamMIA.html

Response:

I got this in the mail today from a friend of mine THE MOST BEAUTIFUL HEART  (Author Unknown)  One day a young man was standing in the middle of the town proclaiming that he  had the most beautiful heart in the whole valley. A large crowd gathered and  they all admired his heart for it was perfect. There was not a mark or a flaw  in it. Yes, they all agreed it truly was the most beautiful heart they had ever  seen. The young man was very proud and boasted more loudly about his beautiful  heart.  Suddenly, an old man appeared at the front of the crowd and said "Why your  heart is not nearly as beautiful as mine." The crowd and the young man looked  at the old man’s heart. It was beating strongly, but full of scars, it had  places where pieces had been removed and other pieces put in, but they didn’t  fit quite right and there were several jagged edges. In fact, in some places  there were deep gouges where whole pieces were missing.  The people stared – how can he say his heart is more beautiful, they thought?  The young man looked at the old man’s heart and saw its state and laughed. "You  must be joking," he said. "Compare your heart with mine, mine is perfect and  yours is a mess of scars and tears."  "Yes," said the old man, "Yours is perfect looking but I would never trade with  you. You see, every scar represents a person to whom I have given my love. I  tear out a piece of my heart and give it to them, and often they give me a  piece of their heart which fits into the empty place in my heart, but because  the pieces aren’t exact, I have some rough edges, which I cherish, because they  remind me of the love we shared.  Sometimes I have given pieces of my heart away, and the other person hasn’t  returned a piece of his heart to me. These are the empty gouges – giving love  is taking a chance. Although these gouges are painful, they stay open,  reminding me of the love I have for these people too, and I hope someday they  may return and fill the space I have waiting. So now do you see what true  beauty is?"  The young man stood silently with tears running down his cheeks. He walked up  to the old man, reached into his perfect young and beautiful heart, and ripped  a piece out. He offered it to the old man with trembling hands. The old man  took his offering, placed it in his heart and then took a piece from his old  scarred heart and placed it in the wound in the young man’s heart. It fit, but  not perfectly, as there were some jagged edges.  The young man looked at his heart, not perfect anymore but more beautiful than  ever, since love from the old man’s heart flowed into his. They embraced and  walked away side by side. Operation Just Cause POW/MIA Bring Them Home http://hometown.aol.com/tackneyny/brooklyntovietnamMIA.html

Response:

Question:

I tried adderall and it drove me crazy….very anxious and introverted.  My doc prescribed provigil, 200 m g. a day and at the beginning I felt great.  I’m wondering if I could take any other stimulant (dexedrine, ritalin) without feeling anxious and speedy like the adderall, or will all the stimulants affect me the same?  I got anxious on wellbutrin and also on buspar.  I take 30 mg. prozac a day.  Any ideas?  elise    

Response:

Elise-     I have known a couple of people with ADD that started on Adderall and it also made them very anxious. A friend of my mother has a 13-year-old daughter that found this to be the case. When she was switched to Ritalin, she did much better, without any anxiety, peripheral side effects or trembling hands. For me, Ritalin did not work because there seemed to be a much steeper onset and dropoff than I have seen with Adderall.        -Emily

Response:

I just started taking Adderall two days ago after being on ritalin for 6 months. Adderall is much smoother and has a mild crash. Ritalin only worked for about 1 1/2  to 2 hours. Adderall lasts for 3 to 4 hours but isn’t as powerfull. I like Adderall better. Doesn’t make me irritable. Does anybody get anxiety from these. Like worrying about things a little too much, dumb things that you wouldn’t care much about? Please respond, I would love to know how people feel on these. Phil

Response:

I just started taking Adderall two days ago after being on ritalin for 6 months. Adderall is much smoother and has a mild crash. Ritalin only worked for about 1 1/2  to 2 hours. Adderall lasts for 3 to 4 hours but isn’t as powerfull. I like Adderall better. Doesn’t make me irritable. Does anybody get anxiety from these. Like worrying about things a little too much, dumb things that you wouldn’t care much about? Please respond, I would love to know how people feel on these.

Ah,  sounds all too familiar.  I do much better on the Adderall.  Ritalin and I didn’t get along very well.  (I also didn’t get along well with anyone else)   I worried alot before I got on Adderall, now sometimes I have found conspiracies to go along with those worries.  I"ve started a work-out program in the late afternoon.  I find it helps me so much.  I also keep a journal that I right in everyday to help release some of those thoughts. The busier I keep myself, the better I do.  The more I accomplish, the less worries I have.  It can be very exausting to have thoughts like these at times, scary too.  I’m an introvert with ADHD, getting locked in my head could take up hours of trying to find my way out again.  After some reading, and some expiermentation on my part, I’ve found ways to keep myself from being mentally restless.   Take care of your problems that you have with yourself, others, and any type of situation that may be bothering you.  The sooner I do it, that’s one less thing running aroung up there. Good-day P.S.  I don’t know what other people do for this type of problem, this is the way I deal with it.  It’s the way that works for me.

Response:

Question:

I didnt realize how amaryl really kept my bgs in order.  I am trying to find all the allergens that I may have. So I stopped taking it one day.  And this morning my bgs were 160 and five hours later after popcorn in the movie still 160.  I took the Prandin before breakfast and Iam now debating whether to put the amaryl back but I am still not completely clear.  Does anyone think I should not test until this rash is gone and I introduce amaryl back to see if it has an  allergen tome.  I know I should call my doctor but all of them are on vacation after they told me they are always available to me. Cant even trust your own doctor.

While it is not preferable to have readings that high, and you wouldn’t want them that high for a long time (days, weeks, months), that reading is not life-threatening. I hope this helps. Jude —                  - Coming Soon –  BestOrgs.NET         Oak Park, IL  708-848-0134  URL: http://www.pobox.com/~jcrouch

Response:

I didnt realize how amaryl really kept my bgs in order.  I am trying to find all the allergens that I may have. So I stopped taking it one day.  And this morning my bgs were 160 and five hours later after popcorn in the movie still 160.  I took the Prandin before breakfast and Iam now debating whether to put the amaryl back but I am still not completely clear.  Does anyone think I should not test until this rash is gone and I introduce amaryl back to see if it has an  allergen tome.  I know I should call my doctor but all of them are on vacation after they told me they are always available to me. Cant even trust your own doctor. For breakfast I had my favorite of lox and cream cheese on a half of bialy with salad so I really only had about 25 carbs,  I guess the popcorn did me in Loretta Give what you get and get what you give

Response:

a half of bialy

Loretta….what is a bialy? I am not being funny or making fun of a typo..i really haven’t heard of it. : ) Don Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Does anyone have information on Amaryl? Like side effects and such… Any info is appreciated…

Hi. You can ago straight to the manufacturer’s website, http://www.hmri.com. Mfr.’s name is Hoechst Marion Roussell, Inc. It’s pretty technical. You can also do a search on "glimepride", which is the generic name of the drug, or on "Amaryl", and you might come up with something more easily understandable for the non-medical person. I’ve been taking Amaryl for nearly 4 months, and am not aware of having any side effects. The best to you — E. — "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results." (Benjamin Franklin) Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Does anyone have information on Amaryl? Like side effects and such… Any info is appreciated…

Response:

Don I.am.on.amaryl.twice.a.day..Having.been.taking.it.twice.a.day.for.about.two .weeks. Here.are.some.readings.but.this.morning.before.breakfas.103 5/21..140,86.111 5/20,120,110,102 5/19/,130,100,89 5/18.120,102,106 5/17,140,98,didnt.test.third.time 5/16/,166,120,130,bad,day 5/15/140,72,121 I.find.my.bgs.are.getting.better.as.time.goes.by..I.usually.have.high.dawn. phenomen like166,but.that.has.decreased.remarkably. today.was.the.lowest.before,breakfast.bgs Loretta

Response:

Don I.am.on.amaryl.twice.a.day..Having.been.taking.it.twice.a.day.for.about.two .weeks. Here.are.some.readings.but.this.morning.before.breakfas.103 5/21..140,86.111 5/20,120,110,102 5/19/,130,100,89 5/18.120,102,106 5/17,140,98,didnt.test.third.time 5/16/,166,120,130,bad,day 5/15/140,72,121 I.find.my.bgs.are.getting.better.as.time.goes.by..I.usually.have.high.dawn. phenomen like166,but.that.has.decreased.remarkably. today.was.the.lowest.before,breakfast.bgs

Loretta, I think for the most part those are very good numbers. Discounting the morning numbers (because we know you are struggling with dawn phenomenon) it seems most all of your numbers are normal (non-diabetic).   Jude —                  - Coming Soon –  BestOrgs.NET         Oak Park, IL  708-848-0134  URL: http://www.pobox.com/~jcrouch

Response:

To Bonita, I was having swelling (edema), generally didn’t feel well and very poor control after 7 weeks on it. J.C. said: The PI discusses this more thoroughly. What is the PI ?

Package Insert or Prescribing Information.  Both terms seem to work in all situations. Jude —                  - Coming Soon –  BestOrgs.NET         Oak Park, IL  708-848-0134  URL: http://www.pobox.com/~jcrouch

Response:

I asked because of high morning numbers, sometimes as high as 140, and I now rarely go over 120 in the AM. I asked for insulin first… Doc put me on this pill… How did they decide to put you on this? I’m going to ask my doctor if this might be for me instead of insulin once a day. Been using it for about 6 months now and my numbers are much better. Only one near hypo (60mg/dl) and it was just before lunch so no problems!

Type 2, diag. 3/98, glucophage,Amaryl, diet, exercise, born ‘47 Another Soggy Seattle Sysop!

Response:

When I was diagnosed my doctor chose to try Amaryl. When my sister was diagnosed her doctor tried Glucophage. I made it a point to ask him at a previous visit if something in our bloodwork would cause you to choose one or the other. He said it was just a coin flip to see which one would work. Although he did say if the patient is heavier they would lean toward Glucophage. But he did not give a reason why. Steve

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How did they decide to put you on this? I’m going to ask my doctor if this might be for me instead of insulin once a day. Been using it for about 6 months now and my numbers are much better. Only one near hypo (60mg/dl) and it was just before lunch so no problems!

Response:

Glucophage is not associeated with weight-gain. Colleen

Response:

What my doctor said was if a patient was already heavy, he would have chosen Glucophage instead of Amaryl. Not that it caused weight gain. Sorry for the confusion. Steve

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Glucophage is not associeated with weight-gain. Colleen

Response:

No confusion, what you said made sense to me.  If a person is already heavy, you don’t want to give them a drug that may cause additional weight gain. Cynthia

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What my doctor said was if a patient was already heavy, he would have chosen Glucophage instead of Amaryl. Not that it caused weight gain. Sorry for the confusion. Steve Glucophage is not associeated with weight-gain. Colleen

Response:

Just my layman’s opinion, but if you’re on insulin chances are unlikely he’d switch you to something like Amaryl or Avandia. You’re on insulin because your body isn’t producing any. Amaryl, etc is not a substitute for insulin. People taking these non-insulin meds are able to do so because their body -is- making insulin, only that their cells are insulin-resistant and won’t process it. The Amaryl, etc. helps the body process the insulin it makes.

Hmmm, I don’t think this is correct.  Amaryl is a sulfonlyurea, which helps the pancreas make more insulin.  Nothing I have read about these drugs suggest that they do anything to improve cellular insulin resistance.   Grump All things considered, I’d rather be playing golf

Response:

Does anyone here have experience with the drug Amaryl, good or bad? Tim

Response:

Does anyone here have experience with the drug Amaryl, good or bad?

It worked well for me until I began having frequent hypos and had to stop it.  I should add that the hypos are something that appears to be unique to me and not specifically from Amaryl.  I have gotten hypos with other meds as well. — Type 2 http://www.redshift.com/~juliebove/ Julie Bove, posting from new account

Response:

I have been using Amaryl for just over 1 year, and it has worked wonderfully for me. I was diagnosed with a fasting blood sugar level of 300. My doctor started me on 2mg of the drug and of course diet changes and exercise. About 3 months ago my dosage was dropped to 1mg per day. A few times early on my levels dropped into the 50 range. But I have to attribute some of that to learning how to use food to stay in control. Good luck. Steve

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone here have experience with the drug Amaryl, good or bad? Tim

Response:

Does anyone here have experience with the drug Amaryl, good or bad?

I’ve been on it (4mg once a day) for 3

Question:

painting by numbers. Linda, trembling hands (or people with misbehaving kitties)

Response:

painting by numbers. Linda, trembling hands (or people with misbehaving kitties)

I understand the frustration of trembling hands so very well. I have some little prints I’ve been meaning to frame for months, but they need to be trimmed and I don’t want to handle the knife with shaking hands (and my partner insisted I promise not to use it when she’s not here anyway). Using chopsticks is high on my list of things not to do with a tremor. Fiona just call it "modern art" you’re "going against the formalism" of the paint by numbers * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!

Response: