OCD and self sabotage
Question:
Nk, havent seen you around for a while hope you are ok? "No Kidding!" <nokidd…@ria.net.IF.YOU.SPAM.ME.YOU.SUCK.ROCKS
wrote in
message news:yxdvb.12302$Wy4.5833@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
If it’s any consolation, my husband is bald. He was bald when I met him and it didn’t stop me from falling in love with him. We’ve been happily married for 15 years. NK
Response:
Good time to offer the: http://www.themeatrix.com/ Dislaimer: R Rated. It’s a little disgusting about animal treatment. Erik – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -ikke wrote:
"Super Mario" <supermario077SPAMF…@yahoo.com wrote in message news:23gvb.444470$pl3.185972@pd7tw3no… snip It’s simply being exposed to forbidden knowledge. Sorry to disappoint you, nothing special, just ordinary OCD. Everybody with OCD thinks they are a very special case and that they were exposed to forbidden knowledge that others never discovered before… How do you pull away from "unlearning" and "not knowing" that anymore? I know the feeling, but again this "matrix alike" question is very common to OCD as well. I asked the doctor for a "forget pill" when I was 8 years old
To conclude with a positive note, I finally found a very solid generic solution to all kind of OCD dragons for once and for all. I’m sure you get out of this deadlock as well with professional help…
Response:
"Super Mario" <supermario077SPAMF…@yahoo.com
wrote in message
news:NJvvb.450832$6C4.153098@pd7tw1no…
Can I ask what the generic solution was for you that worked? Drugs or behavior therapy (tried the later, did absolutely nothing).
My solution is without drugs and even without professional therapy, but the more I read about CBT on this forum, the more I get convinced that it is very similar to CBT with the accent on the ‘C’. I already tried on this forum to explain it, but it seems very difficult to communicate, partly due to the language barrier (English is my third language), partly due to this slow medium (you may google for my name on this forum). Even professional helpers aren’t capable to explain a method without interaction with their client. The "forbidden knowledge" you talked about is nothing else but knowledge about life itself. Life (physical and spiritual) is a self organizing system. Such systems organize spontaneously from very simple to very sophisticated systems. The human mind is a good example of this (not only in a time span of years or months but every single moment). You said somewhere that all the things you took for granted are merely illusions. This is more or less what a self organizing system is all about : starting from nothing it raises up to a very sophisticated system. It is like pulling yourself up on your own bootstraps (bootstrapping is a psychological and philosophical term). A rational being has no other choice but assuming that it is capable to do that. This is the escape gate from OCD. By doing this, you will discover that you will spiral up to stability and hapiness… For more info on this, you can google for my previous posts… As a matter of fact, I’m glad I once had OCD, because this gave me a deep knowledge about psychology, philosophy and nature in its whole. Knowledge that I could never learn from books or anything else.
Response:
Good advise. Thanks. I’ve always been the romantic on everything, thinking even with doctors I’ll meet one that truly cares. But it goes against human nature, especially since a doctor has to see so many patients. Mario – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Erik wrote:
Yes, there may be droughts, hunger, and pestilence, but never an asshole shortage. (Accept what I can’t change…) I’d recommend against being a passive patient. If you can, do your research before you go and ask for the drugs you want. Try not to play the word cames, just tell them what you have and cut to the chase about medication. My current pdoc gives me the bum’s rush in about ten minutes, but I walk away with what I came for. It’s perfectly okay with me. However, he’s still professional. I had bad luck with SSRI’s before, but because of my pdoc’s insistence, I’m currently on Lexapro and I apparently need it. I just tried going down recently and I found myself sunlight starved, clenching my teeth, starting to ruminate about emails, conversations, etc., and waking early. Hang in there. Erik Super Mario wrote: Hi Erik: You know what, the last time I saw a physchiatrist, I became convinced that the biggest problem with mental illness is the indifference in so many the proffesionals tackling it. Some down right don’t care, and just listen to your "babbling" while trying to check off some list to identify what your problem is. So many don’t ask the right questions, simply because you’re just another subject along a conveyer belt. When I meet a physchiatrist that isn’t an indifferent robot, I think my hope will start there. Thanks for the encouragement. I’m definitely going to try my luck again early next year. Mario Erik wrote:
Response:
"loz" <lawrence.whale@ntlworld-REMOVE_THIS-.com
wrote in message
news:wLwvb.4765$4Y6.3738@newsfep4-winn.server.ntli.net…
Nk, havent seen you around for a while hope you are ok?
Thanks for asking. I’m taking anatomy & physiology and it’s kicking my @ss! It’s a very time consuming class but I’m done in one more month. NK
Response:
I can really relate to your symptoms, Mario. For me, it isn’t so much my physical appearance as my emotional appearance. I obsess about if I seem too serious, don’t laugh at something I would ordinarily think was funny if not for OCD, cannot become sexually aroused b/c of OCD, etc….. I have been around a long time w/OCD, that is, I have been diagnosed and treated and medicated for awhile, but the symptoms, while I have tools to deal with them, are still present. It sucks, but I think of the fact that there are many people with worse troubles, and also there are people who are bothered and don’t know what’s wrong. At least I do know what’s wrong and I know what to do, which, while simple, isn’t easy. I haven’t posted for awhile, I think I will start again. Keep up the good fight. "Super Mario" <supermario077SPAMF…@yahoo.com
wrote in message
news:Q1%ub.441646$9l5.391917@pd7tw2no… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Hi: I thought I’d share a little on my own battles with OCD, which have proven to be very horrifically unique. A few years ago my OCD suddenly crossed over to self sabotaging, by which I mean my mind constantly probes my insecurities and fears and tries to make them come true in a tangible way. For me, most of these fears have to do with physical appearance and perceptions… For example, I woke up from bed one morning and noticed some hair on my pillow. I suddenly became insecure about potentially losing my hair and going bald. Based on past experiences with destroying my appearance, I knew my mind probably has the capability to make it happen, and I became frightened. Fueled by this fear, my mind became fixated on my hair 24/7, each hair line, applying stress to it. Every small movement of the head, I feared- and imagined- hair falling out. Each time I combed my hair, looked in the mirror, or had any contact with my hair, the self destructiveness intensified. With every hair dropping to the floor, it justified my fear that I would in fact going bald, and I became even more fixated. One week into the regime, and I was actually losing much more hair than normal. Perhaps it was the horrendous stress my mind was applying to my hair and my body, perhaps it was the intense mental and negative imageries that were the cause, but whatever it was, it was real. It has the capacity to reach out and destroy parts of yourself you absolutely took for granted before then. Some other examples include hygiene, such as fearing I make sweat and stink when I’m close to people. My mind then becomes fixated on that, and I crank myself up to a level of unbelievable nervousness when I’m close to people to really make myself sweat. As you can imagine, when all the things you take for granted and all sense of securities are gone (as they’re merely illusions), true hell on earth begins. I think OCD exists now for me mainly in the form of obsessing over making an insecurity come true, not by will obviously, but fueled by fear. The more I fear it, the more I cannot pull away from
it.
Response:
Can I ask what the generic solution was for you that worked? Drugs or behavior therapy (tried the later, did absolutely nothing). Thanks, – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
I know the feeling, but again this "matrix alike" question is very common to OCD as well. I asked the doctor for a "forget pill" when I was 8 years old
Response:
Yes, there may be droughts, hunger, and pestilence, but never an asshole shortage. (Accept what I can’t change…) I’d recommend against being a passive patient. If you can, do your research before you go and ask for the drugs you want. Try not to play the word cames, just tell them what you have and cut to the chase about medication. My current pdoc gives me the bum’s rush in about ten minutes, but I walk away with what I came for. It’s perfectly okay with me. However, he’s still professional. I had bad luck with SSRI’s before, but because of my pdoc’s insistence, I’m currently on Lexapro and I apparently need it. I just tried going down recently and I found myself sunlight starved, clenching my teeth, starting to ruminate about emails, conversations, etc., and waking early. Hang in there. Erik – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Super Mario wrote:
Hi Erik: You know what, the last time I saw a physchiatrist, I became convinced that the biggest problem with mental illness is the indifference in so many the proffesionals tackling it. Some down right don’t care, and just listen to your "babbling" while trying to check off some list to identify what your problem is. So many don’t ask the right questions, simply because you’re just another subject along a conveyer belt. When I meet a physchiatrist that isn’t an indifferent robot, I think my hope will start there. Thanks for the encouragement. I’m definitely going to try my luck again early next year. Mario Erik wrote: Take a deep breath, admit that you have OCD, and get some help from a professional and compationate physchiatrist. It’s well worth the effort. I’ve learned to judge the doctor by his staff. If you get somebody that sounds harrassed or has missed their true calling as a prison matron, then politely say "thank you" and move on to the next. I’ve found some really good phychiatrists and I really regret not doing it 20 years earlier. What you wrote below is half self-fulfilling prophecy and half magical thinking. It’s logical only within the closed loop that you’ve created. I think you really need to get some relief from medications before you can look at this stuff from a psychology perspective. So permanent damage. Fortunately, no. There’s more then just hope. OCD can be effectively treated. Untreated OCD is hell on earth. Please take the next step. Erik
Response:
Hi AD: I sense your situation is different from mine (see my response to Erik), but I think we’re on the same book (versus page) here Regarding just letting go and letting the chips fall, I’ve tried that, but the fact that I’m probing and trying to realize all my fears means unless I’m completely dead inside will I not get rattled. Otherwise I’m just fooling myself. Ok, so I come to terms with losing my hair completely. My mind then just moves on to something I care about. It’s like this demon inside I can’t rid of that knows all my worst fears. There’s no escape, only fooling yourself, which never lasts. Mario – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -AD wrote:
On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 08:36:00 +0000, Super Mario wrote: The more I fear it, the more I cannot pull away from it. This is true for me also, Mario. I have panic disorder in addition to ocd. Instead of the ocd thoughts generating self-doubt, they generate panic attacks. It is very hard to separate real fear from anxiety attack fear. It’s a mind/body connection that is hard to sever. I find that after 15 years there isn’t much true fear left, especially when I am smack dab in the middle of it. I just hang in, and wait, and hope for the best. That’s what I’m doing now. Sometimes we just have to let the cards fall as they may, and do our best to deal with the results. I’m a pro-active person, so even though I am suffering now, I remind myself there’s hope and one day I will feel better. There’s really not to much else you can do. AD
Response:
If it’s any consolation, my husband is bald. He was bald when I met him and it didn’t stop me from falling in love with him. We’ve been happily married for 15 years. NK
Response:
On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 00:56:36 +0000, Super Mario wrote:
My mind then just moves on to something I care about. It’s like this demon inside I can’t rid of that knows all my worst fears. There’s no escape, only fooling yourself, which never lasts. Mario
I hear you Mario, my obsessions like to change on me too. They used to be really obvious…hurting myself, hurting others, fear of sharp objects etc Knowing they were so obvious, they were easier to ignore. When I came off my medication they took the form of everyday worries, so I didn’t recognize them until my panic disorder came back full steam. I asked awhile ago if this "changing of obsessions" was common. A bunch of people posted back that it happened to them too. I think it occurs with all of us. It’s the nature of the illness. I really believe, though, that thought-stopping and medication can work well. I’m practicing my thought-stopping techniques again, but I am out of practice and it’s slow going. O well, I’m so messed up right now, I have nothing better to do anyway! Always, AD
Response:
Hi AD: I’ve talked to people online as well, though once I got down to discussing the actual symptoms in detail, it seems mine differs from most people’s. I can control my actions 100%- it’s just my thoughts that are constantly looking for *logical* ways to destroy me, fueled not by some hidden desire (ie: cutting myself to release pain), but plain fear of it coming true. Lets say you woke up one day knowing exactly what to concentrate on to make your hair fall out. How do you pull away from "unlearning" and "not knowing" that anymore? It’s simply being exposed to forbidden knowledge. Sorry for trying to point out that my condition is so "different", but I think it’s important for me to do that out until I sense otherwise. I was wondering, what kind of meds are on you right now, and for how long? I agree even mental and emotional sickness may be controlled by something physical such as medication. I think what I need is basically something that not only alters my brain chemistry, but consciousness, as my disease has permeated me so deep it’s driven by my consciousness. I’m about as messed up as one can get, so if misery loves company, I’m with ya there. And all this without anyone truly understanding or even knowing. My family doesn’t get it, and often think I’m throwing a fit when in fact I’m in hell. I call what I’m going through the "curse." – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
I hear you Mario, my obsessions like to change on me too. They used to be really obvious…hurting myself, hurting others, fear of sharp objects etc Knowing they were so obvious, they were easier to ignore. When I came off my medication they took the form of everyday worries, so I didn’t recognize them until my panic disorder came back full steam. I asked awhile ago if this "changing of obsessions" was common. A bunch of people posted back that it happened to them too. I think it occurs with all of us. It’s the nature of the illness. I really believe, though, that thought-stopping and medication can work well. I’m practicing my thought-stopping techniques again, but I am out of practice and it’s slow going. O well, I’m so messed up right now, I have nothing better to do anyway! Always, AD
Response:
On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 03:57:50 +0000, Super Mario wrote:
I was wondering, what kind of meds are on you right now, and for how long?
Hi Mario, I just started back on zoloft 3 weeks ago. Unfortunatley, there is not enough in my system yet to be effective. I was on zoloft for 6 years with great success, no symptoms whatsoever. I wanted to be free of meds, but I have accepted that I really cannot be, at least not well. So I am going back. I have xanax to take in the meantime, but it is effective for only 4-6 hours and I only take it when I am physically exhausted and can’t ride the attacks out any longer. I am a very self-relient person, but every now and then I need chemical help. No shame in this, as I have a chemical problem. I can’t fix my brain, I can only cope with it’s deficiancies. This time I plan to stay on medication for good. I want a normal life and I have that (mostly) on meds. Always, AD
Response:
I hear with Zoloft, lower dosages take care mostly of the depression only, while with much higer dosages, it may start to have a positive effect on the OCD. I’m not sure where 100 mg lies in the spectrum of things… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -ChuckE wrote:
I am on 100 mg. of Zoloft right now. It doesn’t get rid of the symptoms, obviously, but it seems to make them more manageable and also helps with the underlying depression, which can be almost as bad as the OCD, left untreated. "Super Mario" <supermario077SPAMF…@yahoo.com wrote in message news:ng0wb.475672$9l5.468498@pd7tw2no…
Response:
I am on 100 mg. of Zoloft right now. It doesn’t get rid of the symptoms, obviously, but it seems to make them more manageable and also helps with the underlying depression, which can be almost as bad as the OCD, left untreated. "Super Mario" <supermario077SPAMF…@yahoo.com
wrote in message
news:ng0wb.475672$9l5.468498@pd7tw2no… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Hi Chuck: You keep up the good fight as well. I think I understand what you’re going through. My mind concentrates on mainly sabotaging my physical appearance and outwardly perceptions from people, because not to sound vein, I was a teenager when all this shit started, and that was what I cared about. It’s hell on earth, only you feel completely alone and unable to truly convey how you feel inside to others. I’ll rot and die, and still people wouldn’t have the slightest clue what went down. I’m curious, what kind of meds are you on right now aside from any other programs? I plan on going back to the dreaded doc next year and trying my luck again. If I go out I want to at least look myself in the eye and said I gave it a real shot. Mario ChuckE wrote: I can really relate to your symptoms, Mario. For me, it isn’t so much my physical appearance as my emotional appearance. I obsess about if I seem
too
serious, don’t laugh at something I would ordinarily think was funny if
not
for OCD, cannot become sexually aroused b/c of OCD, etc….. I have
been
around a long time w/OCD, that is, I have been diagnosed and treated and medicated for awhile, but the symptoms, while I have tools to deal with them, are still present. It sucks, but I think of the fact that there
are
many people with worse troubles, and also there are people who are
bothered
and don’t know what’s wrong. At least I do know what’s wrong and I know
what
to do, which, while simple, isn’t easy. I haven’t posted for awhile, I
think > > I will start again. Keep up the good fight. > > "Super Mario" <supermario077SPAMF…@yahoo.com
wrote in message
> > news:Q1%ub.441646$9l5.391917@pd7tw2no… > >>Hi: > >>I thought I’d share a little on my own battles with OCD, which have > >>proven to be very horrifically unique. A few years ago my OCD suddenly > >>crossed over to self sabotaging, by which I mean my mind constantly > >>probes my insecurities and fears and tries to make them come true in a > >>tangible way. For me, most of these fears have to do with physical > >>appearance and perceptions… > >>For example, I woke up from bed one morning and noticed some hair on my > >>pillow. I suddenly became insecure about potentially losing my hair and > >>going bald. Based on past experiences with destroying my appearance, I > >>knew my mind probably has the capability to make it happen, and I became > >>frightened. Fueled by this fear, my mind became fixated on my hair 24/7, > >>each hair line, applying stress to it. Every small movement of the head, > >>I feared- and imagined- hair falling out. Each time I combed my hair, > >>looked in the mirror, or had any contact with my hair, the self > >>destructiveness intensified. With every hair dropping to the floor, it > >>justified my fear that I would in fact going bald, and I became even > >>more fixated. One week into the regime, and I was actually losing much > >>more hair than normal. Perhaps it was the horrendous stress my mind was > >>applying to my hair and my body, perhaps it was the intense mental and > >>negative imageries that were the cause, but whatever it was, it was > >>real. It has the capacity to reach out and destroy parts of yourself you > >>absolutely took for granted before then. > >>Some other examples include hygiene, such as fearing I make sweat and > >>stink when I’m close to people. My mind then becomes fixated on that, > >>and I crank myself up to a level of unbelievable nervousness when I’m > >>close to people to really make myself sweat. > >>As you can imagine, when all the things you take for granted and all > >>sense of securities are gone (as they’re merely illusions), true hell on > >>earth begins. I think OCD exists now for me mainly in the form of > >>obsessing over making an insecurity come true, not by will obviously, > >>but fueled by fear. The more I fear it, the more I cannot pull away from > > it.
Response:
Just think of all that time to yoursef in amonth when your done, good luck with it Lawrence "No Kidding!" <nokidd…@ria.net.IF.YOU.SPAM.ME.YOU.SUCK.ROCKS
wrote in
message news:3vxvb.13877$Wy4.1586@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
"loz" <lawrence.whale@ntlworld-REMOVE_THIS-.com wrote in message news:wLwvb.4765$4Y6.3738@newsfep4-winn.server.ntli.net… Nk, havent seen you around for a while hope you are ok? Thanks for asking. I’m taking anatomy & physiology and it’s kicking my
@ss!
It’s a very time consuming class but I’m done in one more month. NK
Response:
Hi Chuck: You keep up the good fight as well. I think I understand what you’re going through. My mind concentrates on mainly sabotaging my physical appearance and outwardly perceptions from people, because not to sound vein, I was a teenager when all this shit started, and that was what I cared about. It’s hell on earth, only you feel completely alone and unable to truly convey how you feel inside to others. I’ll rot and die, and still people wouldn’t have the slightest clue what went down. I’m curious, what kind of meds are you on right now aside from any other programs? I plan on going back to the dreaded doc next year and trying my luck again. If I go out I want to at least look myself in the eye and said I gave it a real shot. Mario – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -ChuckE wrote:
I can really relate to your symptoms, Mario. For me, it isn’t so much my physical appearance as my emotional appearance. I obsess about if I seem too serious, don’t laugh at something I would ordinarily think was funny if not for OCD, cannot become sexually aroused b/c of OCD, etc….. I have been around a long time w/OCD, that is, I have been diagnosed and treated and medicated for awhile, but the symptoms, while I have tools to deal with them, are still present. It sucks, but I think of the fact that there are many people with worse troubles, and also there are people who are bothered and don’t know what’s wrong. At least I do know what’s wrong and I know what to do, which, while simple, isn’t easy. I haven’t posted for awhile, I think I will start again. Keep up the good fight. "Super Mario" <supermario077SPAMF…@yahoo.com wrote in message news:Q1%ub.441646$9l5.391917@pd7tw2no… Hi: I thought I’d share a little on my own battles with OCD, which have proven to be very horrifically unique. A few years ago my OCD suddenly crossed over to self sabotaging, by which I mean my mind constantly probes my insecurities and fears and tries to make them come true in a tangible way. For me, most of these fears have to do with physical appearance and perceptions… For example, I woke up from bed one morning and noticed some hair on my pillow. I suddenly became insecure about potentially losing my hair and going bald. Based on past experiences with destroying my appearance, I knew my mind probably has the capability to make it happen, and I became frightened. Fueled by this fear, my mind became fixated on my hair 24/7, each hair line, applying stress to it. Every small movement of the head, I feared- and imagined- hair falling out. Each time I combed my hair, looked in the mirror, or had any contact with my hair, the self destructiveness intensified. With every hair dropping to the floor, it justified my fear that I would in fact going bald, and I became even more fixated. One week into the regime, and I was actually losing much more hair than normal. Perhaps it was the horrendous stress my mind was applying to my hair and my body, perhaps it was the intense mental and negative imageries that were the cause, but whatever it was, it was real. It has the capacity to reach out and destroy parts of yourself you absolutely took for granted before then. Some other examples include hygiene, such as fearing I make sweat and stink when I’m close to people. My mind then becomes fixated on that, and I crank myself up to a level of unbelievable nervousness when I’m close to people to really make myself sweat. As you can imagine, when all the things you take for granted and all sense of securities are gone (as they’re merely illusions), true hell on earth begins. I think OCD exists now for me mainly in the form of obsessing over making an insecurity come true, not by will obviously, but fueled by fear. The more I fear it, the more I cannot pull away from it.
Response:
Hi Erik: You know what, the last time I saw a physchiatrist, I became convinced that the biggest problem with mental illness is the indifference in so many the proffesionals tackling it. Some down right don’t care, and just listen to your "babbling" while trying to check off some list to identify what your problem is. So many don’t ask the right questions, simply because you’re just another subject along a conveyer belt. When I meet a physchiatrist that isn’t an indifferent robot, I think my hope will start there. Thanks for the encouragement. I’m definitely going to try my luck again early next year. Mario – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Erik wrote:
Take a deep breath, admit that you have OCD, and get some help from a professional and compationate physchiatrist. It’s well worth the effort. I’ve learned to judge the doctor by his staff. If you get somebody that sounds harrassed or has missed their true calling as a prison matron, then politely say "thank you" and move on to the next. I’ve found some really good phychiatrists and I really regret not doing it 20 years earlier. What you wrote below is half self-fulfilling prophecy and half magical thinking. It’s logical only within the closed loop that you’ve created. I think you really need to get some relief from medications before you can look at this stuff from a psychology perspective. So permanent damage. Fortunately, no. There’s more then just hope. OCD can be effectively treated. Untreated OCD is hell on earth. Please take the next step. Erik
Response:
"Super Mario" <supermario077SPAMF…@yahoo.com
wrote in message
news:23gvb.444470$pl3.185972@pd7tw3no… snip
It’s simply being exposed to forbidden knowledge.
Sorry to disappoint you, nothing special, just ordinary OCD. Everybody with OCD thinks they are a very special case and that they were exposed to forbidden knowledge that others never discovered before…
How do you pull away from "unlearning" and "not knowing" that anymore?
I know the feeling, but again this "matrix alike" question is very common to OCD as well. I asked the doctor for a "forget pill" when I was 8 years old To conclude with a positive note, I finally found a very solid generic solution to all kind of OCD dragons for once and for all. I’m sure you get out of this deadlock as well with professional help…
Response:
Thanks. I may request Zoloft then the next time I see my therapist (haven’t in 3 years now). Paxil did nothing for me. I’ve heard of the new Paxil CR (controlled release), but if Paxil never worked for me, I don’t think CR will do anything. Do you discern any advantages with Xanax over Zoloft? From what you typed it seems there are none. Thanks, Mario – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -AD wrote:
On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 03:57:50 +0000, Super Mario wrote: I was wondering, what kind of meds are on you right now, and for how long? Hi Mario, I just started back on zoloft 3 weeks ago. Unfortunatley, there is not enough in my system yet to be effective. I was on zoloft for 6 years with great success, no symptoms whatsoever. I wanted to be free of meds, but I have accepted that I really cannot be, at least not well. So I am going back. I have xanax to take in the meantime, but it is effective for only 4-6 hours and I only take it when I am physically exhausted and can’t ride the attacks out any longer. I am a very self-relient person, but every now and then I need chemical help. No shame in this, as I have a chemical problem. I can’t fix my brain, I can only cope with it’s deficiancies. This time I plan to stay on medication for good. I want a normal life and I have that (mostly) on meds. Always, AD
Response:
Take a deep breath, admit that you have OCD, and get some help from a professional and compationate physchiatrist. It’s well worth the effort. I’ve learned to judge the doctor by his staff. If you get somebody that sounds harrassed or has missed their true calling as a prison matron, then politely say "thank you" and move on to the next. I’ve found some really good phychiatrists and I really regret not doing it 20 years earlier. What you wrote below is half self-fulfilling prophecy and half magical thinking. It’s logical only within the closed loop that you’ve created. I think you really need to get some relief from medications before you can look at this stuff from a psychology perspective.
So permanent damage.
Fortunately, no. There’s more then just hope. OCD can be effectively treated. Untreated OCD is hell on earth. Please take the next step. Erik Super Mario wrote:
Hi Erik: Thanks for the response. What’s happening to me is unique IMO in that I’ve lost all sense of security, as I’ve come to realize if you obsess over something in a certain way (ie: losing your hair), it could really happen. Security then is just an illusion. Hair is just one of infinite examples. With my hair, my mind would first apply pressure to my hairline, almost visualizing it falling off. Then I’ll begin to associate things in the past to serve as a reminder to apply this pressure, for example, when I’m talking, combing my hair, etc. Eventually, this complex neurological connection forms in my mind where basically everything I do will remind me to obsess over my hair falling out, until it really doe
Fortunately, no. There’s more then just hope. OCD can be effectively treated. Untreated OCD is hell on earth. Please take the next step. Eriks, validating my fear, in turn strengthening the – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
obsession. The most scary part of it all is that none of the above is based on paranoia or illusions, but logic, just logic no one was meant to be exposed to. Losing my hair is just one out of infinite examples; most of what I’ve obsessed and managed to destroy have to do with my physical appearance, hygiene, and people’s perceptions of me. Another example would be stuttering. I’ve always stuttered a bit, and one day, I can even remember the exact moment I said to myself that night while I was slightly bored- "What if I stuttered a lot more than I do right now? That would really decrease the quality of my life even more." My mind quickly went into a frenzy as I became aware of every word uttered when I spoke, my mind start focusing in on itself, even causing physical discomfort in the brain area. Each time I stuttered, it reinforced the fear and insecurity, and my brain sabotaged even more my ability to speak. Since that obsession my stuttering has gotten extremely bad, and my mind is not even obsessing over it anymore (as mission accomplished already). So permanent damage. I’ve gone on Paxil in the past, but it never really did anything for me. To be fair I never really divulged my situation to the doctor, and just told him I had OCD. But as you can see, my disease has basically evolved into a completely different and much more evil beast. Erik wrote: Hi Mario, This is really common and I’ve done this myself. In college I had a dream about loosing my hair (ie, I just woke up with my hair laying on my pillow), and sure enough it kicked off a long obsession about losing my hair. Within a few weeks, I had an allergic reaction to a shampoo and my hair thinned dramatically to the point where you could see my skull. I think I finally resigned myself that I would go bald, and I seriously considered shaving my head just to get over it. I looked around at all the bald men. I noticed that they still seemed happy, had friends and girlfriends, so like a condemned man facing his fate, I finally accepted it wouldn’t be so bad or at least I’d give it a try (like I had a choice). From there, I must have forgotten about the whole deal. It no longer had the power to torment me, so my OCD waited for the next fear to torment me with. I’m closing in on 40 and I still have plenty of hair. I guess it’s a fear that every man goes through unless you have father’s and grandfather’s with plenty of hair (I don’t). Are you on medication? It’s a personal choice but it does sound like it would be a good thing. Erik
Response:
Hi Erik: Thanks for the response. What’s happening to me is unique IMO in that I’ve lost all sense of security, as I’ve come to realize if you obsess over something in a certain way (ie: losing your hair), it could really happen. Security then is just an illusion. Hair is just one of infinite examples. With my hair, my mind would first apply pressure to my hairline, almost visualizing it falling off. Then I’ll begin to associate things in the past to serve as a reminder to apply this pressure, for example, when I’m talking, combing my hair, etc. Eventually, this complex neurological connection forms in my mind where basically everything I do will remind me to obsess over my hair falling out, until it really does, validating my fear, in turn strengthening the obsession. The most scary part of it all is that none of the above is based on paranoia or illusions, but logic, just logic no one was meant to be exposed to. Losing my hair is just one out of infinite examples; most of what I’ve obsessed and managed to destroy have to do with my physical appearance, hygiene, and people’s perceptions of me. Another example would be stuttering. I’ve always stuttered a bit, and one day, I can even remember the exact moment I said to myself that night while I was slightly bored- "What if I stuttered a lot more than I do right now? That would really decrease the quality of my life even more." My mind quickly went into a frenzy as I became aware of every word uttered when I spoke, my mind start focusing in on itself, even causing physical discomfort in the brain area. Each time I stuttered, it reinforced the fear and insecurity, and my brain sabotaged even more my ability to speak. Since that obsession my stuttering has gotten extremely bad, and my mind is not even obsessing over it anymore (as mission accomplished already). So permanent damage. I’ve gone on Paxil in the past, but it never really did anything for me. To be fair I never really divulged my situation to the doctor, and just told him I had OCD. But as you can see, my disease has basically evolved into a completely different and much more evil beast. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Erik wrote:
Hi Mario, This is really common and I’ve done this myself. In college I had a dream about loosing my hair (ie, I just woke up with my hair laying on my pillow), and sure enough it kicked off a long obsession about losing my hair. Within a few weeks, I had an allergic reaction to a shampoo and my hair thinned dramatically to the point where you could see my skull. I think I finally resigned myself that I would go bald, and I seriously considered shaving my head just to get over it. I looked around at all the bald men. I noticed that they still seemed happy, had friends and girlfriends, so like a condemned man facing his fate, I finally accepted it wouldn’t be so bad or at least I’d give it a try (like I had a choice). From there, I must have forgotten about the whole deal. It no longer had the power to torment me, so my OCD waited for the next fear to torment me with. I’m closing in on 40 and I still have plenty of hair. I guess it’s a fear that every man goes through unless you have father’s and grandfather’s with plenty of hair (I don’t). Are you on medication? It’s a personal choice but it does sound like it would be a good thing. Erik
Response:
Hi: I thought I’d share a little on my own battles with OCD, which have proven to be very horrifically unique. A few years ago my OCD suddenly crossed over to self sabotaging, by which I mean my mind constantly probes my insecurities and fears and tries to make them come true in a tangible way. For me, most of these fears have to do with physical appearance and perceptions… For example, I woke up from bed one morning and noticed some hair on my pillow. I suddenly became insecure about potentially losing my hair and going bald. Based on past experiences with destroying my appearance, I knew my mind probably has the capability to make it happen, and I became frightened. Fueled by this fear, my mind became fixated on my hair 24/7, each hair line, applying stress to it. Every small movement of the head, I feared- and imagined- hair falling out. Each time I combed my hair, looked in the mirror, or had any contact with my hair, the self destructiveness intensified. With every hair dropping to the floor, it justified my fear that I would in fact going bald, and I became even more fixated. One week into the regime, and I was actually losing much more hair than normal. Perhaps it was the horrendous stress my mind was applying to my hair and my body, perhaps it was the intense mental and negative imageries that were the cause, but whatever it was, it was real. It has the capacity to reach out and destroy parts of yourself you absolutely took for granted before then. Some other examples include hygiene, such as fearing I make sweat and stink when I’m close to people. My mind then becomes fixated on that, and I crank myself up to a level of unbelievable nervousness when I’m close to people to really make myself sweat. As you can imagine, when all the things you take for granted and all sense of securities are gone (as they’re merely illusions), true hell on earth begins. I think OCD exists now for me mainly in the form of obsessing over making an insecurity come true, not by will obviously, but fueled by fear. The more I fear it, the more I cannot pull away from it.
Response:
On Thu, 20 Nov 2003 08:36:00 +0000, Super Mario wrote:
The more I fear it, the more I cannot pull away from it.
This is true for me also, Mario. I have panic disorder in addition to ocd. Instead of the ocd thoughts generating self-doubt, they generate panic attacks. It is very hard to separate real fear from anxiety attack fear. It’s a mind/body connection that is hard to sever. I find that after 15 years there isn’t much true fear left, especially when I am smack dab in the middle of it. I just hang in, and wait, and hope for the best. That’s what I’m doing now. Sometimes we just have to let the cards fall as they may, and do our best to deal with the results. I’m a pro-active person, so even though I am suffering now, I remind myself there’s hope and one day I will feel better. There’s really not to much else you can do. AD
Response:
Hi Mario, This is really common and I’ve done this myself. In college I had a dream about loosing my hair (ie, I just woke up with my hair laying on my pillow), and sure enough it kicked off a long obsession about losing my hair. Within a few weeks, I had an allergic reaction to a shampoo and my hair thinned dramatically to the point where you could see my skull. I think I finally resigned myself that I would go bald, and I seriously considered shaving my head just to get over it. I looked around at all the bald men. I noticed that they still seemed happy, had friends and girlfriends, so like a condemned man facing his fate, I finally accepted it wouldn’t be so bad or at least I’d give it a try (like I had a choice). From there, I must have forgotten about the whole deal. It no longer had the power to torment me, so my OCD waited for the next fear to torment me with. I’m closing in on 40 and I still have plenty of hair. I guess it’s a fear that every man goes through unless you have father’s and grandfather’s with plenty of hair (I don’t). Are you on medication? It’s a personal choice but it does sound like it would be a good thing. Erik – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Super Mario wrote:
Hi: I thought I’d share a little on my own battles with OCD, which have proven to be very horrifically unique. A few years ago my OCD suddenly crossed over to self sabotaging, by which I mean my mind constantly probes my insecurities and fears and tries to make them come true in a tangible way. For me, most of these fears have to do with physical appearance and perceptions… For example, I woke up from bed one morning and noticed some hair on my pillow. I suddenly became insecure about potentially losing my hair and going bald. Based on past experiences with destroying my appearance, I knew my mind probably has the capability to make it happen, and I became frightened. Fueled by this fear, my mind became fixated on my hair 24/7, each hair line, applying stress to it. Every small movement of the head, I feared- and imagined- hair falling out. Each time I combed my hair, looked in the mirror, or had any contact with my hair, the self destructiveness intensified. With every hair dropping to the floor, it justified my fear that I would in fact going bald, and I became even more fixated. One week into the regime, and I was actually losing much more hair than normal. Perhaps it was the horrendous stress my mind was applying to my hair and my body, perhaps it was the intense mental and negative imageries that were the cause, but whatever it was, it was real. It has the capacity to reach out and destroy parts of yourself you absolutely took for granted before then. Some other examples include hygiene, such as fearing I make sweat and stink when I’m close to people. My mind then becomes fixated on that, and I crank myself up to a level of unbelievable nervousness when I’m close to people to really make myself sweat. As you can imagine, when all the things you take for granted and all sense of securities are gone (as they’re merely illusions), true hell on earth begins. I think OCD exists now for me mainly in the form of obsessing over making an insecurity come true, not by will obviously, but fueled by fear. The more I fear it, the more I cannot pull away from it.
Response:
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